NAD+ Forums

Are you allowed to recommend a drug that has no published studies in human yet?

AUKC wrote: ↑Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:15 am

Drdavid wrote: ↑Tue Nov 26, 2019 7:09 am NMN typically improves moods and focus.

Curious if you recommend it to patients who have mild anxiety?

I have not. However, I have told patients that have anxiety that they should take NAD/NMN to possibly improve mitochondrial function.

Its interesting the correlation between mithocondrial disorders and psychiatric illness, included anxiety and depression.
I do some quotes from 2 interesting studies:

There is evidence that people with known mitochondrial disorders suffer psychiatric illness at rates higher than the general population.
A mitochondrial bioenergetic basis of depression
N. Jennifer Klinedinst & William T. Regenold
Link: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25262287

Here is another intesting study, more specific the depression and mitochondrial disorders.
Brain is highly active organ with high energy consumption and organs with highest energy demand are more susceptible to the deleterious effect of reduced energy production. Mainly neurons obtain energy from mitochondrial OXPHOS. Neuron obtains energy through glycolysis but brain is unable to store glycogen so constant supply of glucose is needed. When oxidative phosphorylation is compromised, neurons are unable to meet their energy demand and alteration in their various physiological functions occurs due to reduced ATP production. Studies have shown that chronic mild stress inhibits mitochondrial OXPHOS, dissipates mitochondrial membrane potential and damages mitochondrial ultrastructure in various brain regions including hippocampus, cortex and hypothalamus of mice [77, 78]. These observations lead to the conclusion that most probably depression is caused by energy impairment in the brain due to mitochondrial dysfunction [79, 80].

Mitochondrial Dysfunction in Depression
Yashika Bansal and Anurag Kuhad
Link: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4981740/


In my personal experience, using Alybe by Nature NMN sublingual, I assume 8 tablets daily and I can affirm a mood more stable, no more depression symptoms, rare anxiety and, above all, an improved mental and physical energy. I'm 50 now and for me it works well.
David

Thank you for the links and your brief story David.
Your input is always appreciated.

daviddean wrote: ↑Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:14 am Its interesting the correlation between mithocondrial disorders and psychiatric illness, included anxiety and depression.
I do some quotes from 2 interesting studies:

There is evidence that people with known mitochondrial disorders suffer psychiatric illness at rates higher than the general population.
A mitochondrial bioenergetic basis of depression
N. Jennifer Klinedinst & William T. Regenold
Link: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25262287

Here is another intesting study, more specific the depression and mitochondrial disorders.
Brain is highly active organ with high energy consumption and organs with highest energy demand are more susceptible to the deleterious effect of reduced energy production. Mainly neurons obtain energy from mitochondrial OXPHOS. Neuron obtains energy through glycolysis but brain is unable to store glycogen so constant supply of glucose is needed. When oxidative phosphorylation is compromised, neurons are unable to meet their energy demand and alteration in their various physiological functions occurs due to reduced ATP production. Studies have shown that chronic mild stress inhibits mitochondrial OXPHOS, dissipates mitochondrial membrane potential and damages mitochondrial ultrastructure in various brain regions including hippocampus, cortex and hypothalamus of mice [77, 78]. These observations lead to the conclusion that most probably depression is caused by energy impairment in the brain due to mitochondrial dysfunction [79, 80].

Mitochondrial Dysfunction in Depression
Yashika Bansal and Anurag Kuhad
Link: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4981740/


In my personal experience, using Alybe by Nature NMN sublingual, I assume 8 tablets daily and I can affirm a mood more stable, no more depression symptoms, rare anxiety and, above all, an improved mental and physical energy. I'm 50 now and for me it works well.
David

David,
I had read the first article but not the second. Thank you for sharing this with the community. I agree that we can see psychiatric applications for NMN/NAD products. I fear that many of those that are speaking about NAD/NMN currently are hoping to patent a molecule for pharmaceutical purposes and financial gain. NAD/NMN is a product that could be used for millions of people and it is inexpensive.
Thank you again for the research. I always enjoy your posts.

Yes, again... Could be coincidence but I am experiencing unexplained anxiety which is quite a physical thing as oppose to it feeling psychological. 
It may be the NMN or resveratrol? 
I was taking 1g of NMN but I think, from today, I'm going to reduce to 500mg. I'm only 120 pounds and 46 so I think the dosage may have been too high? 

rachwozere wrote: ↑Mon May 15, 2023 12:21 am Yes, again... Could be coincidence but I am experiencing unexplained anxiety which is quite a physical thing as oppose to it feeling psychological. 
It may be the NMN or resveratrol? 
I was taking 1g of NMN but I think, from today, I'm going to reduce to 500mg. I'm only 120 pounds and 46 so I think the dosage may have been too high? 

 

Hi, the symptoms could be related to low methyl pools.  Used up NAD+ takes the form of nicotinamide (NAD) which if you get too much is attached to a a methyl group and excreted out the urine.  Methyl groups are needed to make creatine for muscle and dopamine for the brain, so if you're low you could experience depression, possibly anxiety.  Take an equal amount of TMG in milligrams with your NMN and this should help.

 

Jocko you nailed it, low methyl groups. TMG is a great place to start.

Yes.
I actually was searching for information on nmn relating to depression and came across your posting. I registered to replay to you. I'm very very torn right now. Nmn has improved my physical strength and cognitive functions greatly. I'm a person who had depression the whole life. My father was suicidal and I was depressed since I was a child but couldn't be on meds because of the side-effects then I've found Ketamine and it helped with my depression, social anxiety and ocd tremendously. It really turned my life and I was able to normal things I wasn't able to before. This is my background. 

Now, after taking nmn 500mg daily in the morning, I felt depression starts creeping back in almost right away. Then I feel dull and kind of robotic in daily life. I get irritated easily and my ocd got slightly worse, too. Another thing is it weakens the effect of ketamine treatment. I don't get dissociation (it's supposed to happened while you're treated) anymore as my mind is so clear and awake. 

I'm not sure what to do. The last thing I want is my depression coming back but I really like how my mind is clear and logical with better physical strength. This is really odd situation for me. I wonder if you keep taking nmn with tmg(I do take it with equivalent mg of nmn). DId your mood get better or do you still notice the same or did you stop taking it? Hope you can still read this and replay for me. 

Hi!
I too have depressions for 15 years now. I startet taking 1 mg nmn powder 2 days ago, because of the studies on mices, where it had positive effects regarding depression.
The first day I was a bit nervous, so on 2nd day (yesterday) I took only 500 mg nmn.
Yesterday I had a great day, but today i woke up early and could't sleep well.
Also my day startet feeling more depressed than normal. So I just took 250 mg nmn today.
How did you continue? Are you still taking nmn and did your mood get better?
I dont' t take tmg, but I take high dosis of b vitamins that should also support methyl pools.