NAD+ Forums

It seems almost all of the newer RBS products are being formulated only as liposomal versions. I know that liposomal formulations are able to bypass the gut and enter the bloodstream more easily, but is this necessarily a desirable thing for all of these supplements? We're taking these in the first place due to early scientific studies using these supplements, but almost none of the studies we're basing our interest on use liposomal formulations. They use the plain formulations. It seems if we want to achieve the positive effects seen in the studies, we'd want to take the supplements in the form closest to those used in the studies.

It's possible that the lipo versions will result in increased positive effects, but it seems it could also decrease positive effects or make it difficult to know what a reasonable dose would me. It seems we're adding an additional unknown to supplements where there is not much known to start with. 

Am I thinking about this incorrectly? Would love to hear some other perspectives. 
 

Just thinking about vitamins, some are water soluble and others are fat soluble. Fat soluble ones are extremely poorly absorbed if no fat present when taken. 
I suspect the same is true for many other supplements (we do know for a fact that resveratrol is fat soluble - Dr. Sinclair with his fatty yoghurt mixture) - rule of thumb for me would be if it doesn't dissolve in water then a lipo version is probably going to really enhance bioavailability. 
I'm sure there is a better scientific explanation behind why lipo is better and others will be able to post this. 

I would like to see real data for the products for absorption, all I see or could not find the information is anecdotal. My question would be is Nad+ is a big molecule, adding it in a package, liposomal, would that make it even a bigger overall thing and if that can actually be absorbed? I would expect test results showing that it is absorbed, preferably with people, graphs etc. Even if in house by the company. I think some here actually reported their increase of Nad levels from test kits here.

Liposomal looks to be the way to go for consumption doses, how much more effective? Does it aid in absorption by being a bigger package? I do not know for sure. Anecdotally I've been improving my Sp02 levels since I've been taking Alive/Renue By Science Nad boosters. My Garmin 245 watch measures Sp02/heartrate/breaths etc. and my fitness age went from 43 to now 26 years in 5 months. This is with tracking being done by Garmin Connect software with the watch. Previously I was taking NR, for over a year, these gains occur after taking liposomal products. In June I will be 63.

rhett wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:02 am It seems almost all of the newer RBS products are being formulated only as liposomal versions. I know that liposomal formulations are able to bypass the gut and enter the bloodstream more easily, but is this necessarily a desirable thing for all of these supplements? We're taking these in the first place due to early scientific studies using these supplements, but almost none of the studies we're basing our interest on use liposomal formulations. They use the plain formulations. It seems if we want to achieve the positive effects seen in the studies, we'd want to take the supplements in the form closest to those used in the studies.

It's possible that the lipo versions will result in increased positive effects, but it seems it could also decrease positive effects or make it difficult to know what a reasonable dose would me. It seems we're adding an additional unknown to supplements where there is not much known to start with. 

Am I thinking about this incorrectly? Would love to hear some other perspectives. 
 


 

Well I can attest anecdotally that Liposomal NAD+, NMN and NR are definitely delivering much more of each into my body. I am benefitting far more.

One of the biggest problems with many supplements is daily dose... and that changes based on its bioavailability. I understood why SL was superior to just plain powder, and was willing to take my NMN and NAD+ via SL. But Liposomal simply delivers more and for the same reason, it gets past the destructive process in the gut.

As far as daily dose goes, I went from 1000mg of sublingual tablets to 250mg of liposomal and also with CaKG, i feel comfortable that taking it liposomally is delivering the max possible. It's also about economy... as your supply lasts longer.

Once it has been shown these supplements are safe to take, i think it's up to us what our daily dose is.

Thinks like Berberine and Fisetin have had issues with bioavailability too. So I was please to see them offered liposomally. I take your point, it is just that i happen to beleive the stuff i am taking goes further with LSG, which is what i am after.

As to your title question, could it hinder effects? I could see that happening only if the supplements are best absorbed in the stomach and I can't think of any offhand.
 

rhett wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:02 am It seems almost all of the newer RBS products are being formulated only as liposomal versions. I know that liposomal formulations are able to bypass the gut and enter the bloodstream more easily, but is this necessarily a desirable thing for all of these supplements? We're taking these in the first place due to early scientific studies using these supplements, but almost none of the studies we're basing our interest on use liposomal formulations. They use the plain formulations. It seems if we want to achieve the positive effects seen in the studies, we'd want to take the supplements in the form closest to those used in the studies.

It's possible that the lipo versions will result in increased positive effects, but it seems it could also decrease positive effects or make it difficult to know what a reasonable dose would me. It seems we're adding an additional unknown to supplements where there is not much known to start with. 

Am I thinking about this incorrectly? Would love to hear some other perspectives. 
 


 

There is quite a lot of research into liposomal delivery and it's ability to protect a drug or molecule past the GI tract and directly to the tissues intact.  This greatly increases bioavailability, which is especially useful for difficult to absorb molecules like resveratrol, fisetin, or many other flavonoids. 

So although studies are typically done using non-liposomal versions, the science showing liposomes superior delivery and increased bioavailability is well documented and isn't controversial at all.  The increased effectiveness is used to calculate proper dosage.  Again, not controversial.  It is all based on a number of studies on liposomal delivery.  You can choose not to believe the studies and take loads of resveratrol with olive oil or yogurt, up to you.

As for me, I've done extensive NAD+ level tests and they have all validated the idea that liposomal delivery greatly increases intercellular NAD+ levels over standard, non-lipo oral delivery.  But it's easy for anyone to prove  this for themselves.  Just order a couple of NAD test kits, a jar of NMN powder, and a bottle of Lipo NMN capsules. 
 
 

Adding another anecdote to the discussion, I was using 900 mg of tru niagen NR and went to 600 mg of liposomal NR from Renue by Science. Been using it over two months now, and I can honestly say that the liposomal NR is more effective at limiting my joint and back pain than the tru niagen. As for NAD+ synthesis, we will have to wait for more studies, but the studies I have seen on liposomal fisetin and berberine in mice clearly indicate large percentage increases in bioavailability. 47 times as much for fisetin and 6 times as much for berberine.

Note, however, that the size of the liposomes in one study will impact the bioavailability from a different size in a different study, but by how much is probably unknown at this time.

jocko6889 wrote: ↑Sat Mar 26, 2022 10:54 pm

rhett wrote: ↑Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:02 am It seems almost all of the newer RBS products are being formulated only as liposomal versions. I know that liposomal formulations are able to bypass the gut and enter the bloodstream more easily, but is this necessarily a desirable thing for all of these supplements? We're taking these in the first place due to early scientific studies using these supplements, but almost none of the studies we're basing our interest on use liposomal formulations. They use the plain formulations. It seems if we want to achieve the positive effects seen in the studies, we'd want to take the supplements in the form closest to those used in the studies.

It's possible that the lipo versions will result in increased positive effects, but it seems it could also decrease positive effects or make it difficult to know what a reasonable dose would me. It seems we're adding an additional unknown to supplements where there is not much known to start with. 

Am I thinking about this incorrectly? Would love to hear some other perspectives. 
 



 

There is quite a lot of research into liposomal delivery and it's ability to protect a drug or molecule past the GI tract and directly to the tissues intact.  This greatly increases bioavailability, which is especially useful for difficult to absorb molecules like resveratrol, fisetin, or many other flavonoids. 

So although studies are typically done using non-liposomal versions, the science showing liposomes superior delivery and increased bioavailability is well documented and isn't controversial at all.  The increased effectiveness is used to calculate proper dosage.  Again, not controversial.  It is all based on a number of studies on liposomal delivery.  You can choose not to believe the studies and take loads of resveratrol with olive oil or yogurt, up to you.

As for me, I've done extensive NAD+ level tests and they have all validated the idea that liposomal delivery greatly increases intercellular NAD+ levels over standard, non-lipo oral delivery.  But it's easy for anyone to prove  this for themselves.  Just order a couple of NAD test kits, a jar of NMN powder, and a bottle of Lipo NMN capsules. 
 
 

 

I have to agree with Jocko here. Ive done both forms and Lipo is the way to go especially when dealing with these fragile molecules that could get broken down in the gut before they reach the desired tissues.
 

In my opinion, Lipo is the only way to go….  
 

In the question which is better, the original oral uptake of NMN/NR/NAD+ or LIPO (of these products) now offering a measured 24 hour Nano pass thru into the bloodstream of 100% of these products, the Answer IS:
LIPO, hands down.

An older person like myself, is going to benefit more, and quicker to these RenuebyScience products, in regeneration to healthier levels that were farther diminished than younger subjects. My response has shown this in both delivery means, in recovering an earlier healthier Life style. Lipo just evens it out, where as earlier powders were 4 hour spikes, requiring more dosage for a measurable effect. LIPO dosage is less, more economical.

Some of the questions also addressed to a comparison of benefit based on earlier trials lends itself to thinking of these products responses as drugs, rather than Enzymes, which flow through your body in constant changing variables, just working well. That's a better approach, just replenish enough to get the job done. Everybody's bodies and Life Styles are different. Do what best works for you and share for inspiration to others. Ben
Pickleball101, 81 .. on to 101.